Actress and Producer Jill Wagner: The Business of Being a Creative Entrepreneur

Jill Wagner (00:00)

But now I just know myself. I know my place, I know my worth, all of that. And I think when you bring that to the table, as well as you try to calm that ego and, you know, always come in with, I always come in with a humble attitude and one of gratitude and appreciation, but I don't let anybody walk all over me. So, there's a fine line of being someone that other people want to work with, and I think that's a really important thing in our industry because you could have some really talented people, but then they're horrible to work with, and you're just like, pass, you know.

Announcer (00:38)

Welcome to THRIVE, a Paychex Business Podcast. Your blueprint for navigating everything from people to policies to profits. And now your host, Gene Marks.

Gene Marks (00:48)

Hey, everybody. Welcome back to another episode of the Paychex THRIVE podcast. My name is Gene Marks. I'm here with Jill Wagner. She's an American actress, a producer, a television personality. She's worked across acting, hosting, and producing. You might know her from the Great American Family channel as well as the Hallmark Channel. Starring in a bunch of movies, Jill, that I've never seen, like Maggie's Christmas Miracle, Christmas Cookies.

Jill Wagner (01:13)

You should see that because it's really good.

Gene Marks (01:16)

Okay, so, and I just want to just be clear about the Hallmark channel. It's a great channel. It's hilarious. My daughter-in-law, my wife, my daughter, they like, love, they know you like very well because they've seen all the movies.

Jill Wagner (01:28)

Sí.

Gene Marks (01:28)

So it's. I'm a guy. Okay. So, you know, you know, give me, give me a little...

Jill Wagner (01:33)

Have you seen Lioness?

Gene Marks (01:35)

No.

Jill Wagner (01:41)

I know it sounds weird because it says Lioness, but Morgan Freeman, Nicole Kidman, Zoe Saldana, I mean, that's my jam right now. So, you need to watch that. I'm going to challenge you the next time we talk. You have to have seen Lioness.

Gene Marks (01:55)

I'll make a note to watch Lioness. And for what it's worth, I do watch a lot of TV because I travel a lot. So, I will make a note of it.

Jill Wagner (02:02)

Make a note of it. There will be quiz.

Gene Marks (02:04)

Let's talk about you. So, you know, this conversation is, as I said before we even started recording is, you know, we have a business audience. We have a lot of business owners here. We have a lot of freelancers, we have a lot of independents. The, you are an independent, right? I mean, so, you know, let's start at the beginning. Like, you went to college, and you actually took a business degree, and then you moved into entertainment. So I'm kind of curious. First of all, what was your degree in college?

Jill Wagner (02:31)

And so, my, yeah, my, my... Sorry, go ahead.

Gene Marks (02:34)

No, I was just gonna ask you, like, so, and how was that? Has that had any impact on you in your professional life?

Jill Wagner (02:40)

Yeah, I mean, I think when I was trying to figure out what I wanted to do in college, I didn't know at the time. And so I was kind of just like, well, I gotta pick something. And in conversations with my father, my grandfather, and my grandmother, they were always just like, well, business is a good thing to have in your tool belt. Right? You'll know how to run a business. You'll know how it, you know how that side of the fence works. Although in my mind, I was always a creative, but I just, I did it at the time because I didn't, I was like, well, I don't know what else to do. Thank God I did because I feel like I've used that across the board in so many aspects of my life. Obviously, I went into entertainment, but what people don't understand when they think, oh, I'm just going to go out and be an actress or an actor and I'm just going to do all this stuff. Behind the art is business. It's nothing but business. It's a massive business. And you have to know how to run your own business because you are your store, you are your storefront. And once I started looking at my career like a business and less like this is just my dream, and not that you can't combine the two, but I think once you start to understand how it works, you'll thrive in it, you know, because you can also get taken advantage of and you can have your business stolen away from you.

Gene Marks (04:13)

Correct. So let me dig into that just a little bit with you. So, for starters, one of the biggest, well, actually, I'm going to take a step back. Talk to me about, like your business, for starters. Okay. It's you, right? So you are, it's, you're a freelancer. You're set up. I'm an accountant. So, you're, I'm sure you're set up with your own tax entity that represents you, correctly? So you know, where does the work come from? Like you, you have an agent. You have, do you, do you get your work yourself? Do you, are you the biggest issue freelancers that I, when I, when I talk to them, it's like they get wrapped up in projects and then the project ends, and they're like, oh, no, like, wow, you know, like, I've got nothing on the horizon now, and I'm kind of stuck. Does that happen to you, or are you always, you know, thinking about the next project?

Jill Wagner (05:01)

Well, I think you have to, again, look at yourself like a business. You have to build your boardroom kind of. You have to build out your employees and you...

Gene Marks (05:15)

And a team.

Jill Wagner (05:16)

And a team. And it's really, I mean, I suppose you could do it all by yourself. And I'm not saying that it couldn't be done. I'm just saying if you want to be efficient about it, and look, I could take my own advice because I just last year got an agent, and I have pretty much run my own business without an agent. I've just had a manager. That is probably doable because I am a hustler. I am someone who absolutely does not wait for the phone to ring. I call a million people. I'm in the process right now. I mean, I have a hit show on TV right now with Lioness, and I'm on to the next. I'm already creating, like, the next thing in my head that I'm pitching. And I think you have to surround yourself with a good team, and they all have ways of helping. I mean, you could sit around and wait for an audition, or you could just make it work. I mean, Lioness came about because I kept saying to my husband, I don't feel like I've been given the opportunity in our industry to play the kind of role that I really think I excel at. And I'm not, I guess it's just passed me by. And then, which led to him saying, well, why don't you, why don't you make something? Why don't you create something? And that ultimately came about the treatment that we brought to Taylor Sheridan, to which, you know, he has kind of turned into this amazing world of Lioness. But that all came from me, just not sitting there and waiting for the knock at the door.

Gene Marks (06:55)

You know, it takes a certain level of self-confidence. There are a lot of, and also, a certain level of ego to do something like that, you know...

Jill Wagner (07:04)

Or maybe it's not. Maybe it's just ignorance or, you know what I mean? Like, it's kind of the fearlessness of it all.

Gene Marks (07:11)

Right.

Jill Wagner (07:13)

And I really do sometimes think that because people are like, you're not going to just call Taylor Sheridan. I'm like, yeah, I am.

Gene Marks (07:19)

Okay, so when you call Taylor Sheridan, and people are saying like, oh, you're really not going to do that. You know, what you, what goes to your mind when you're, when you're going to pitch yourself to be hired? You know, like, you know, like...

Jill Wagner (07:32)

I think, here's the thing. I think, I think when you know it, and this is at least, this is, I can only speak for myself, when I'm pitching myself for a project or pitching a project that I believe in, all of my nerves go out. I don't have them. I'm just so sure of it, and I'm almost like, look, I want you to be involved, and if you don't want to, that's fine, it's your loss, but I'm going to the next one. I have this energy that I think when you're in the pocket, when you're where you're supposed to be, when you're saying what you're supposed to be saying when you're doing it, it's just, I call it that sweet spot. And every time I am, I'm just, I just know it, I just am like I'm so sure of it that maybe that's it. Maybe I just convinced the other person that I am, too. I don't know.

Gene Marks (08:22)

I also think it's also like a level because, I'll tell you the way that I feel whenever I'm calling up a prospect and even if it's a cold prospect, I've always been of the inclination that like hey man, like what I'm selling like the products that I'm selling, and we sell like CRM products like Salesforce and you know, things like that, like this can help you, you know, like I am trying, I'm, you know, you will benefit from this product. Just like if you are calling up Taylor Sheridan and pitching yourself to be in this project, it's because you're like, this is a good thing. Like this will benefit you and benefit others around you. So I'm not just doing this just for me. It's not just a selfish thing.

Jill Wagner (08:56)

Yeah. If it's symbiotic like it, it's always like you always want to say this is how I can help you.

Gene Marks (09:04)

Right.

Jill Wagner (09:04)

Right? And then, you know, ultimately by doing that it's going to help.

Gene Marks (09:08)

Right. Okay, right now as you're working on your project and again, just again trying to expand your business as it is, what is your follow-ups like? I mean do you make, are you tenacious enough to make one call to a producer and then leave it at that, or you kind of...

Jill Wagner (09:28)

I'll tell you another funny story about Taylor. I called Taylor on this. He said he wanted to write it, and then, like, a year goes by, and I don't really hear from him. And I was emailing and calling, and, you know, there was a lot that went on there. And I remember thinking, well, what, who could I call that could get to him? Like, you know, he's kind of the top of the food chain. And then I thought, well, I do know his wife. So I called, I called Nick up, and I was like, look, you know, it kind of sucks, I can't get Taylor's attention on this project, and blah, blah, blah. I think in about 15 minutes, he called me, and he was like, that was a low blow. I'm like, you know, I fight fire with fire. I, you know, because I believed in it so much, though. And of course, you know, he was like, I'm doing it. I'm doing it. I've just got, like, five other things on my plate right now. And he was true to his word. He was true to his word. He, you know, he came through. But, no, I don't... Now, look, I'm not going to hound somebody if I feel like they're not the best fit and they don't have... I knew from talking to Taylor that he had the passion for what this show was, and I knew that he was, in my mind, the only writer for the project. So I think you have to hound the person as long as you know that there's a passion on the other side, and if they're really not into it, I'm not going to drag them. You don't drag a horse to the water to make it drink. You know, you just, you have to, it's a feel. And I think you get better as you're, I mean I'm 47 years old. I've been in this game for over 20 years. If you asked me all these questions 20 years ago, I wouldn't have the same answer, you know, but now I just know myself. I know my place, I know my worth, all of that. And I think when you bring that to the table, as well as you try to calm that ego and, you know, always come in with, I always come in with a humble attitude and one of gratitude and appreciation, but I don't let anybody walk all over me. So, there's a fine line of being someone that other people want to work with. And I think that's a that's a really important thing in our industry because you can have some really talented people, but then they're horrible to work with, and you're just like, pass. You know?

Gene Marks (11:54)

Fair enough, fair enough. You know, it's funny you mentioned about, you know, being 47. It is unbelievable, the difference in a person when you're 47 versus when you're 27.

Jill Wagner (12:04)

Oh, gosh, I don't even know that girl.

Gene Marks (12:07)

Yeah, you don't even know that person. And you do think to yourself, like, if you are pitching a project to somebody at an age of being in your mid-40s, where you're like, you just do have a level of confidence saying, I know this is going to work. I've been around the block. I've been doing this for 20 years. It does... And I think it's just a lesson for younger people that there really is, you know, there is justification in getting experience and taking a deep breath and being, you know, you got your whole life in front of you to pitch the big things, but you do approach it a different way. How do you, Jill, how do you deal with failure? I mean, your business sucks when it comes to this. There's a lot of it. I don't know if you know this or not how unusual, maybe you do, how unusual your field is. Most people, if they're pitching a project, they get turned down, they get turned down. In your business, you get pushed away, you get lied to, you get promised that something's going to happen, but then it doesn't happen. Things move forward and then it doesn't move forward. There's discrimination in the sense that, like, you know, they're going to pick somebody else to do a project instead of you just because they look a certain way as opposed to the way you. There's and I really think there's a reason why so many people in your industry are in therapy is because there is just an inordinate amount of failure. So how do you deal with failure?

Jill Wagner (13:29)

Yeah, I mean, look, I think I try not to take it so personal. I don't say, you know, wow, I am lesser than because I didn't book this job. I am lesser than because they didn't, you know, gravitate towards my treatment for this new show. I am lesser than because, I mean, look, it's all in the big scheme. It's the game of life, right? Everywhere you go, there's all of that that you just mentioned. You can't get away from it. I mean, this is just the world in which we live in. But I think it's really important to have a real, for me, it's been about having that real foundation of where I came from and the values that my father and my family instilled in me and being really, really set. Like, I know who I am, I'm really confident in who I am. I'm not cocky about it because, look, I'm not the smartest girl in the room. I'm not the best looking girl in the room. But like, I know who I am because I was raised in it. And so, when you, when you know that and when you're set in it and when you can find it, sometimes it takes a minute, you got to find it. Because in my 20s, you know, that was, it was a harder thing to deal with. But I always came back to the neutral of like, wait a minute, like, okay, who did my dad raise? Who is that girl? Who is that girl? And then having people around you that are real. You know, all of my friends are very, very honest real salt-of-the-earth people, and they reflect who I am, and they remind me of who I am all the time. So, you know, especially my husband, when I don't book a job or something, like, he's just that sounding board, you know, that just reminds me, hey, just on to the next. Like, there's so much opportunity out there to, you know, to get like... Let's just say I pitch 10 shows a year and nine of them don't work. Well, there might be one that does, but there's, there's a never-ending line of opportunity out there. You just can't get tired. That's my thing. I'm like, gosh, sometimes I'm like, who this is like taking it out of me. But I think because of my passion, I love the chase. And I think you have to remind people too that once you get it, it's awesome. But you will forever remember that thrill of the chase. And part of the chase is the failure and getting back up and doing all of that. It's all so beautiful, and it's all so amazing. And you just, like I said, you can't take it so personally.

Gene Marks (16:15)

Great. A lot of freelancers also struggle with accepting versus disqualifying work. And I'm curious to get your thoughts on that? This is the case across all industries. Sometimes we work with clients or customers or other people that we don't particularly, you know, want to work with or we work on a project that we know is not exactly quite right for us. But I don't know, we need the money, or we did it, you know, that must have happened to you, I'm sure, more than once during the course.

Jill Wagner (16:50)

Oh my God, yeah. Well, I think, you know, I've had people in my life say, well, once you did this, you're not ever going to have to do that again. And I haven't done anything really bad. Look, I like nothing like X-rated or anything like that, but all of the little things, I look back on it and yeah, at the moment I'm like, okay, I'm looking over at my peers, you know, like Scarlett Johansson is doing this and all of these, you know, but I also am like, for whatever reason, like, I believe in God. I always look up, and I'm like, this is where he wants me. And I am not about to argue with that man. Like, you know, it's, I'm, this is where He wants me. This is where I'm supposed to be. And all of those little moments lead you to, well, it led me to where I am right now. And that is exactly where I want to be. I'm in, I'm living my dream right now. So, all of those moments, you have to look at it this way. If you can be in your line of work and be around it, although you're not doing like the Oscar Award-winning thing or whatever it is, if you're just doing it, you're sharpening your tools, you're in the environment, you're always apt to meet somebody who by the way, may own, like may run a studio in 10 years. You never know. People, yeah, they always, they climb the ladder really fast in my industry. And so, I think you just always have to look at it as an opportunity and not, and, and if you bring that attitude into the game, like I hate when people come to smaller work and, and they're like, ugh, this is so whatever. I'm like, I'm bringing 100% today, I need 100% from you. And let's go kill it. Whatever it is, let's go kill it. You know?

Gene Marks (18:45)

You mentioned Scarlett Johansson, and obviously, you are, you know, competing against all sorts of different actors and actresses. Talk to me about your competition. Do you watch your competition? Do they make you angry? Do you, you know, do you feel, are you a very competitive person, or are you the kind of person that's just in your own head and working on your own skills and not, because different people are different types, you know?

Jill Wagner (19:14)

Sí.

Gene Marks (19:14)

So how do you deal with competition?

Jill Wagner (19:16)

You know, in my 20s, I was, I would watch and I would critique and I would sit there and think, okay, I need to do this better, and I need to do that. And I, maybe I get my hair like hers or maybe I'll dress like her. You know, there's a lot of that. Now, it is, it's a really fun time for me, because I almost want to do everything that they don't do. I almost am trying to find somebody, you know, in my line of work that hasn't been seen and that's really hard because there's just a plethora of really amazing talent and I'm also not, I don't care about the awards anymore. I don't care about any of that. This has now become about what do I want to say in the industry? What do I want my kids to remember me for? And I want to have fun. I want to have, I want my day-in and day-out life to be a pleasant experience and one that I'm proud of. And so, it's weird, like, I don't, God I used to get so nervous with auditions because I wanted it so bad. And I hate to say it, but like, I want it, but if it doesn't happen, like, that's cool. It's weird when you get older.

Gene Marks (20:39)

Was there a moment where you started to be this? Because we were all like this, Jill. Like in our 20s, we're always just anxious, and we lack self-confidence and we're trying to make a mark for ourselves and trying to get whatever. And then you do hit like a point in your life where you are a little bit more Zen, you know, and maybe you find that religion or maybe, I don't know, a friend dies in a car crash or there's something that just, you know, snaps you out of it and says, you know what, there are bigger and more important things than stressing myself out.

Jill Wagner (21:06)

Well, you just said it. I think life gives you perspective.

Gene Marks (21:10)

Sí.

Jill Wagner (21:10)

And when you haven't had enough of it, you can't really, like, what's your perspective? All you have is like this perfect little thing that you're striving. And then as we get older and you do experience the big emotions and the really important moments in your life and you realize, gosh, I was whining over nothing and everything becomes deeper. And I think that's by design.

Gene Marks (21:35)

Right.

Jill Wagner (21:36)

You know, I do. At least it is with myself.

Gene Marks (21:40)

You know, what I used to do, I started this years ago, is like, if you're ever having like a day, and it's like just a day, and you've got your list of six or seven things that are just, you know, whatever, I would write them down, I carry around like this, I know it's like, like a composition book, you know, from like, you know, school. Like, my list, I'll write down like the five things that are like, pissing me off today. And then you look back on it like a month later, and you're like, what was that? You know, like you don't even remember those. You know what I mean?

Jill Wagner (22:09)

My dad always had this saying that I've kept with me. And he said, Jill, nothing is ever as good or as bad as it seems.

Gene Marks (22:19)

My dad said the exact same thing.

Jill Wagner (22:20)

Yeah. And I'm like, well, I don't know, like, this Lioness ride has been pretty dang good. Like, I'm sorry, but you might be a little off on that. But usually, about the bad stuff, it isn't. It's, you know.

Gene Marks (22:32)

Okay, all right, fair enough. You mentioned your family. You have kids, you're a husband, you've been married for a while, you're in a job that is, it's a, you do sacrifice, Jill. I mean, you know, you are not like a stay-at-home mom, or you're not even like a, you know, corporate mom, where you come home every day. I mean, you're out on the road a lot, and you're hustling and whatever. Talk to me a little bit about how you've balanced that over the years. And what's your advice if you could do stuff differently?

Jill Wagner (23:02)

Yeah, I mean, like, this is a number one question I get, because everybody thinks, oh my gosh, you have it figured out. Look, we, it is a, it is an ongoing painting that we're painting our family, right. And it's like when I try to say, okay, when I go away for more than a month, then everybody comes with me. If I go away for a week, I'm not going to drag the kids out of school and do this and that, you know, but we have, it's like a patchwork quilt at the moment. And we are navigating it as it comes. I mean, I have a 4-year-old and a 5-year-old, so it's been a little easier because they've been younger. But you know, once they, to deal with school and all of that, we've been homeschooling a little bit, and you know, we've been in Texas here for five months. The worst part about it is, is not having the day-in and day-out time that you would get to have if you were a stay-at-home mom. But I also understand that this is my choice, right? Like I'm choosing to go and do this. What I'm hoping is when they get older, they're able to look at me as a mentor and by like, Mom did it. Like when she was in her 40s, she decided to cut off all of her hair, bulk up, look like a dude, and go and do a TV show that her and her dad wrote the treatment for. Okay. Like she did that in her 40s. So hopefully then they're like, you know, whatever they want to do. If they want to be a stay-at-home mom, I think that's the best thing you can do. If they want to go off and run a business, so be it. I just want them to understand there's freedom to do what you want to do, but you just have to figure it out. You can never say, I can't do that. We figure it out. You know, if I, if it means that when I come home, I put my phone down and get down with the girls, and you know, play with them, whatever, color with them, whatever, you do those things. You just make sure that the moments that you have are you're there, you're present.

Gene Marks (25:07)

You know, first of all, there's no right answer for anybody. You know, I've seen different formulas work for different people.

Jill Wagner (25:12)

Sí.

Gene Marks (25:12)

There is one thing that I've seen across the board, and I will tell you this, I can tell you this is a 60-year-old guy with three kids. One is that it's all about balance. And you got to figure out what your right balance is. But more importantly, like the one thing your kids do not want is for you to be needy at a certain age. And I truly believe that they see you and your husband as independent and thriving. And hopefully you'll be doing that when you're 67 as well. You won't be just sitting around begging for their attention, or in the, no kid wants that.

Jill Wagner (25:41)

They're learning from you. Even at 4 and 5, they're learning. Okay, what I mean, they learn to hustle like I tell them all the time. I'm like, come on, let's hustle. Let's do this. Let's do this. There is no, there is no lazy member of our family, I can tell you that.

Gene Marks (25:57)

Fair enough. More questions for you. I have like a bunch of questions, and we've got literally like less than 10 minutes. No, it's good. Let me talk a little like, specifics with you. Let's talk money. Okay? And financial. How good are you with money? How important is it? Do you outsource all of this? Again, you're an independent businesswoman. How, you know, do you know how much cash you have in the bank now? And do you know how much cash you'll likely have in the bank, say, 90 days from now or 120 days from now? Talk to me about how you manage your money.

Jill Wagner (26:33)

Yeah, like I'm forever, gosh, if my husband were here, he'd be laughing because I am a big, like, I want to invest in things. I'm always thinking about, okay, how can, how there's, I have a very little money in the bank and, but, money working for me. I don't like to keep money in the bank. I like to, I like, I don't believe that keeping it in a savings account really does much for you interest-wise. I think most of the time you've gotta, like, I'm big on, let's buy property, let's buy a house, let's buy, let's you know, buy some things that luckily in my, as I've navigated my way through life, I've come in and contact some with some really smart people and I've always asked them questions like, what would you invest in? And you know, so our farm being my number one investment, that was the smartest investment. I think it's like tripled in value since we bought it pre-COVID, and then as we know, COVID hit, and rural land, you know, farms went through the roof. But yeah, I do. I, it is kind of a fun thing for me, oddly enough, because I'm so creative usually, like, I don't like the math part of it, but I love to the investment side of it.

Gene Marks (27:56)

Okay. Do you have any money managers? Do you have an accountant? Do you have an investment, like a wealth manager?

Jill Wagner (28:03)

I do. I have someone that I work with, and then I kind of give them half, and then I take half. So, I like my play money is what I say, and that's investments with like friends and, you know, thing I just get, I get offered a lot of things, and so I have to pick and choose kind of what I want to do.

Gene Marks (28:24)

Good. Let's talk about legal. So, you have contracts. Obviously, you have another business. It's a farm that you own with your husband, your own business that you have as a producer, as an actor. There are contracts involved. There are legal documents involved. Do you lean on an attorney? Are you using ChatGPT? Are you...

Jill Wagner (28:43)

No, no. Attorney all the way. Like, look, I'm not saying that Chat GPT can't, I'm just not into the whole AI thing yet. But I have had a lawyer ever since my career started, so they've been with me. And then my farm, we have a separate lawyer for that. And just two, because of the line of work that I'm in, I realized that we throw charity events at the farm. You know, I'd love to believe that everybody that stepped on the farm had good intentions, but sometimes they don't. And, you know, it's like, can hurt themselves really quickly to just to take advantage of me because I am who I am. So, you, I think if you are anyone in a, what would I say, a social, what's the word that I'm missing? A public person, public persona. You should definitely have a lawyer for that kind of stuff.

Gene Marks (29:40)

Okay. And I do hear, you know, certainly in the creative field, where artists are sometimes taken advantage of by money people or attorneys or agents or...

Jill Wagner (29:52)

Yeah, you hear the horror stories. Absolutely.

Gene Marks (29:54)

You do. So, how do you protect yourself against that?

Jill Wagner (29:56)

You check in. I think, A. You obviously have to find the right person. Right. You have to find someone that you're like, okay, this person doesn't feel like a snake. But also, you have to check in, and you have to say, okay, I want to see statements. I want to see where my money's at. I want to... So, if you don't check in for 10 years, I mean, you'd like to believe that that person is just on the up and up and doing a great job, but what if they're not? And then 10 years goes by, and where's your money? You know?

Gene Marks (30:26)

Okay, all right, that's good. Productivity. So, you have to balance out your day. Give me an idea again, as a business owner, as a, you know, how do you divide up your time during the day between actually doing the work that you've been hired to do versus selling and prepping for maybe thinking ahead, planning for other work versus, I don't know, just going out and working out. You know, how do you balance it all out?

Jill Wagner (30:54)

You know, it's interesting because I have so many different balls in the air. Gosh, there's so many different phases to my life because the physical side of what I do is very important, right? So, like, I'm in the gym an hour and a half a day, so you have to find time for that. Then you also have to find time for, I mean, that's a non-negotiable. That's, you know, that's six days a week, whether I want to or not, because it's part of my job. So, and then you have the kid part, and then you have the husband part, and then you have the work part, and then you have the creative part. I will tell you this, I tried to make it to where I had a schedule, and it didn't last for very long. I have to do my schedule, like that week. I have to just kind of fit things in where I can fit it in. And I always say this, I live in Pivot City. I am so good at pivoting, but yet somehow keeping structure, right? So I think you have to just, and I tell my kids it's very important that they learn the same thing. Like, if we got to pick up and leave, we got to pick up and leave, right? So, it's finding structure within the chaos in my line of work is really important.

Gene Marks (32:17)

You did one thing that demonstrates that even at the very beginning, before we even started recording, you were like, hey, Gene, I have a hard stop, you know, at this time, and I gotta move on. I do the exact same thing. Like, I like to take control of my schedule. I don't want somebody else to be in control of that. And that's, it's really important. Okay, final question, because we only have two minutes left, and I want to make sure I get you out here on time.

Jill Wagner (32:39)

Thank you.

Gene Marks (32:40)

Just give me a little bit of your future, Jill. You know, like you just said, you're 47. Do you think you'll retire? Do you think you'll be 77 and still working? Like, what's the overall game plan?

Jill Wagner (32:52)

So, I have this romantic idea of what I'll be doing, which is I'll be retired on my farm, in my, growing my flowers, and just watching my babies grow up. And, you know...

Gene Marks (33:06)

I have a hard time believing that, no offense. I have a hard time believing, okay?

Jill Wagner (33:10)

So that's my romantic, that's what I, in my book, in my novel version of what Jill does. The realistic side of it is that I have the energy of a 12-year-old boy, and I have so much I want to do, and I love doing it. So that's another part. So, I think when things become daunting and it, and it makes me feel lesser of a person, and it doesn't do anything positive for me, is when I'll stop. So, if that's 48, then it's 48. If it's 98, it's 98. But I think the beauty of it is that I don't feel trapped either way. I absolutely love where my life is going. I am excited to see my girls grow up. I'm excited to see where my career goes, and with our farm, I have this whole other side that I can dip into that's really interesting. So, I don't know, I think it's, the question of it all is exciting to me, and I'm not a, I don't want to map my life out because I told you, I live in Pivot City, so my life can change tomorrow, and I'm okay with it.

Gene Marks (34:26)

Okay, fair enough. Well, you're a great role model for your daughters. I do want to say so. Hopefully, you know, I hope they, I have a daughter as well, and I've always been big into her growing up independent. She is a vet, and I'm very proud of that. You know, for all my three kids, she's the one I'm most, because she is independent. Thank you. Jill Wagner, everybody is an American actress, a producer, a television personality. Supports across acting, hosting, and producing. She's well known for various movies on the Hallmark Channel and, you know, the Great American Family channel. But more importantly, your involvement with Lioness, are you, are you a producer on Lioness or like...

Jill Wagner (35:04)

I'm an EP, and yeah, my husband is too.

Gene Marks (35:06)

Okay. I do want to apologize for two reasons. I'm a huge TV fan. I watch a lot of TV shows. I am a huge Taylor Sheridan fan as well. Didn't even realize he was, you know, connected to this project as well.

Jill Wagner (35:17)

You gotta watch it. It's so good.

Gene Marks (35:20)

I'm wrapping up A Knight of the Seven Kingdoms right now, and I'm actually looking to move on to another show. So, you, I didn't even realize it's also Taylor Sheridan. Not that it takes away anything from you, but I mean, like...

Jill Wagner (35:30)

No, I think, to be honest with you, I think it's the best thing he's written.

Gene Marks (35:33)

That's amazing. Okay, well, that's a hard act to follow because I, you know, some of his shows are just great, so I will check it out. Jill, thank you so much. This is a great conversation. I learned a lot, and I hope our audience will as well, okay.

Jill Wagner (35:44)

Thank you so much for having me.

Gene Marks (35:47)

Do you have a topic or a guest that you would like to hear on THRIVE? Please let us know. Visit payx.me/ThriveTopics and send us your ideas or matters of interest. Also, if your business is looking to simplify your HR, payroll, benefits, or insurance services, see how Paychex can help. Visit the resource hub at Paychex.com/WORX. That's W-O-R-X. Paychex can help manage those complexities while you focus on all the ways you want your business to thrive. I'm your host, Gene Marks, and thanks for joining us. Till next time, take care.

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